Practice Throw Loophole?

[mrsenortyler]

Every so often in practice rounds, I will throw a shot that I am dissatisfied with, and will throw another shot, or a "practice throw." I myself don't even throw from my practice throw, I go to where the original disc was, and throw from there...Just picking up the practice disc along the way.

In tournaments, this is not allowed.

Okay, let's set up a situation. I throw a tee shot (Disc1), that went very close to the OB line, but from the tee pad, nobody can tell if it is OB or not. I declare I am throwing a provisional, and throw my second shot (Disc2) safely in the fairway. When getting to Disc1 and finding it inbounds, according to this rule:

803.01.C ...The unused throws shall not be added to the thrower’s score nor treated as practice throws if the player announces that such additional throws are made as provisional throws prior to taking them.

Disc2 is not a practice throw, and I will not be stroked.

So when someone misses a 15ft putt (in a tournament), what's to keep them from saying "Provisional!" and putting their backup putter into the target in disgust? (as we see loads of players do when playing casual rounds)

[Schoen-hopper]

There are a lot of calls that are made with a group decision. This keeps some common sense in the game. Willfully circumventing the rules is cheating and you could get disqualified.

[Anita]

From the rulebook.... the bold is my addition.


Provisional Throw: An extra throw, agreed upon by a player’s group, that is not added to a player’s score if not used in the completion of the hole. Additionally, a set of provisional throws that will be allowed to complete a hole as an alternative to the original play of the hole, when there is a disputed ruling. Only one set of throws will be counted as the player’s score when a final ruling is made.

I don't think you could get your group to agree with you on this one.

[mrsenortyler]

From the rulebook.... the bold is my addition.


Provisional Throw: An extra throw, agreed upon by a player’s group, that is not added to a player’s score if not used in the completion of the hole. Additionally, a set of provisional throws that will be allowed to complete a hole as an alternative to the original play of the hole, when there is a disputed ruling. Only one set of throws will be counted as the player’s score when a final ruling is made.

I don't think you could get your group to agree with you on this one.

Of course I over looked something!

(2) To appeal the group’s or an official’s ruling: A set of provisional throws may be taken to complete a hole pursuant to 803.01 D
(3) when the player disagrees with the majority group decision and an official is not readily available, or if the player wishes to appeal the decision of an official. The scores from both sets of throws shall be recorded. The proper ruling and score are then determined by the director at the end of the round.

Maybe you could argue your disc got lost in the grass??

I'd never actually bend the rules like this in my favor anyway. I wanted to make sure there weren't holes in the rules, in case something needed to be changed by the rule change committee, or something of that sort.

[Nivek9]

So when someone misses a 15ft putt (in a tournament), what's to keep them from saying "Provisional!" and putting their backup putter into the target in disgust? (as we see loads of players do when playing casual rounds)

I see nothing in the rules that would make one think this would even be an option. Is the first putt lost? Is it out of bounds? Did someone call a foot fault? What would be the reason for calling a provisional? Your suggestion of a hole in the rules seems to be reaching a little. If someone tried this on my card they would get a stroke and a round of laughter. The primary thing to be aware of regarding the provisional is that a group decision has to be reached that it is an acceptable course of action. No group would go for what you suggest.

In the first example speed of play makes it logical. Otherwise someone would have to go all the way down to the lie and check it before proceeding with additional tee shots. But the presumption of a possible OB lie would still need to be agreed upon by the group first.

[mrsenortyler]

So how does one know which rules to give a courtesy warning to?

[Nivek9]

So how does one know which rules to give a courtesy warning to?

Potential courtesy violations are pretty clearly referenced in this rule:

http://www.pdga.com/rules/index.php

Other rules carry their own penalties, some of which may include an initial warning with a stroke for subsequent violations of the rule the player was warned about. For instance 802.01-F states:

"F. All discs used in play, except mini marker discs, must be uniquely marked in ink or pigment-based marking which has no detectable thickness. A player shall receive a warning for the first instance of throwing an unmarked disc if observed by two or more players of the group or an official. After the warning has been given, each subsequent throw by the player with an unmarked disc shall incur one penalty throw if observed by two or more players of the group or an official."

This is one I recently ran into when I pulled a disc out of a basket from a previous group at the GBO. It had no name or other marking on it and a kid came running back to get it. I told him about the rule and let him know I was warning him. He thanked me and actually asked to borrow a marker on the spot.

In my opinion most of the time a warning is the preferred option even if the rules don't allow for it since most people aren't fully aware of all the rules and rather than stroke them and piss them off just make them aware. Then if they do it again and you stroke them they can't plead ignorance. It's all about having fun anyway from my standpoint.

But once you get to a level where you are playing for serious cash or recognition everyone should know the rules and it's less likely you'll get a break on the rules and rightly so.