Is it too early to be thinking for '07?
First, these are the topics discussed in the '05 season meeting and Smitty's response to how these took shape in the '06 season.
smitty wrote:
Here is what was discussed at the meeting on 1-19.
1-The KDGA will pay PDGA sanctioning fees as sponsorship for the tournament.
2-Starting in 07, a TD must promise the KDGA a minimum of $50.00 for hosting a KDGA sanctioned event.
3-In order to be a TD on the Oz Tour, you must be a current KDGA member by April 1.
4-We have decided to adopt the PDGA rules of play for KDGA events.
5-We picked 5 people to represent the Region of the state that they live in. Their duties will include. Collecting KDGA money from events in their region. Distribution of KDGA packages to members in their region. They are responsible for getting KDGA merchandise to be used for run for the roses or CTP prizes to events in their region. The will act as a discipline committee if a problem comes up during the year. By 07, they should be a certified PDGA official.
Western – DM4
Eastern – Emac
Central – Mace
Southwest – Randy
South Central – Shan
6-Rog has volunteered to be the finance director for the KDGA. He will not handle any money. He will keep our “books” and report to the members of the KDGA the current financial situation.
7-Mike Shoenhoffer will be in charge of the points.
8-Smitty will act as the director. Working with the Regional Representatives to make decision in the KDGA.
9-The points will be worth something again this year. The top third point winners in each division will earn a spot into the KDGA season finals. Also the top Open and AM point earner from each region will also qualify for the finals, if they are not in the top third of their division. The last event of the year will also act a wildcard qualifier for the Sunday final, the top nonqualified AM and Open player will earn a spot.
10-The final will be a double elimination match play format. The players will be seeded based on their points. We felt that this would be a fun and exciting way to end the year. It is spectator friendly, and filled with suspense. The winners of each division will then play in a Grand Finale double elimination match play event.
11-The location of the finals has been set for the next 2 years. It will be in Emporia in 06, and Wichita in 07.
12-We want to bring back the roll over Ace fund. If nobody at the event hits an ace, half of the fund rolls on to the next KDGA event. If an ace is hit by a KDGA member, half of the rolled over amount will go to the person who aced. If a nonKDGA member hits the ace, they are only eligible for the ace fund from the current tourney. If a TD chooses to have more then a $1.00 ace fund. They are only required to give the KGDA the amount equal to half the ace fund if it would have been $1.00 a person.
13-We are ready to get rid of the money that we have in the course improvement fund. We currently have $1,660 in the fund. In order to be eligible for the course improvement fund. A club would need to apply to the KDGA, send us a letter stating what the funds would be used for. The improvement must have KDGA on it and be easily visible. The fund can not be used for baskets. It is intended for signs, benches, and other extras on the course. The KDGA may be willing to match funds up to and $500.00.The application would be voted on by the Regional Representatives, and must be approved by at least a 3 to 5 vote.
14-Brett is going to begin a state wide PR campaign. It will include posters, a “blurb”, and many other ways to information about the KDGA out and visible.
1- We implemented with great success. We payed sanctioning for WYCO, GBO, Monkey Island, Hays, Doo Dah, Round-up, Capital City Classic, and will finish with the DD. That is 8 KDGA/PDGA events. I would like to think that we could double this next year.
2- Any tourney that has less then 25 people will be responsible for making up the extra funds.
3- We didn't do a very good job of this. Harv ran 2 events, and Parsons had an event. I guess that it is time to "not be so nice". Next year people WILL be members to host a tourney.
4- I guess the rules were adopted? My group will always play by the rules of disc golf. It is up to every group to enforce the rules.
5- I think that the idea of the Reg. Reps was a good one. All the reps did what ever was asked of them. Randy has moved from Wichita, so I have asked Ryan Biesner from Pratt to take that area over.
6- Because of a job change, and a growing family. This didn't work out as we had hoped. I would love to have the funds made public. Mace pretty much took this job over for Rog. If their is anyone who has the time and would be interested in this job, let us know.
7- Mike took over the points, and did the best job ever. The points have always been updated as soon as results were made public. I hope that Mike wants to do this again.
8- I guess that I acted as the director?
9- The points race is close in many divisions. I have heard lots of talk about who is in, and who is out. We did tweak it a little, by letting the top points earner in each region in each division in.
10- We will see how the finals works out this weekend. I had forgot about the Grand Champion idea? Is that something that we still want to do? It would be just for bragging rights.
11- The finals will be in Wichita next year. We need to figure out were it will be the following year. I like the idea of the region with the most new members getting the final.
12- The roll over Ace fund was back. Several people hit aces, and really enjoyed the bonus $$ I am sure. I think Brett is still walking on air.
13- Only 1 club was interested in the course improvement fund.
14- Brett did a super job on the PR early in the year. We were 100% with newspapers that he was able to contact. It was a big job, that Brett would love to have some help with.
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Ideas for the KDGA in 2007
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Schoen-hopper
- Posts: 6301
- Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2004 12:58 pm
I'll give a summary of what was discussed at this year's KDGA meeting. Smitty and Mace can probably elaborate on some of this. The meeting was very positive. The banquet and awards that followed were a great time for everyone. The trophies for the points winners were very nice and Brian Shield gave out some outstanding "Ambassadors of Disc Golf" awards!
We discussed this season in light of last years goals as mentioned above.
The PDGA sanctioning paid by the KDGA was a great success. We had more PDGA events than ever before and they brought many more players than average KDGA events.
The Ace fund was a great addition to the tour.
The course improvement fun paid out (at the meeting) to the only club that applied for it all year. Emporia Disc Golf Club was matched with money to pay for KDGA stamped concrete tee pads at Peter Pan. I believe it was a $500 check.
The finals location was discussed. Ideas for 2008 and beyond included the region with the most members, the region with the largest increase in members, and a regular set rotation.
One thing that was not a complete success was following through with the rule we made requiring tournament directors to be KDGA members. The consensus seemed to be that there would be no exceptions next year.
We also had some trouble aquiring the $50 minimum per tournament. There was a little disagreement about this issue. Some see that 38 tour events is too many. 11 of these events had less than 10 member show up. So some think that it's not worth losing players from other tournaments for these tournaments that do not benifit the KDGA. Others thought that these small tourneys need the KDGA for promotion and should be cut some slack. Mace brought up the idea of having these small events on the tour every 2 years instead of every year.
There were also some new ideas brought up.
We plan to make the KDGA a PDGA affiliated group. This will mean a $5 discount for anyone who pays PDGA dues through the KDGA. Also a free officials test for anyone who signs up. The KDGA also gets a course directory and a section on the PDGA forum. The first of 3 deadlines to get these dues in will by on 01-01-07. The second being most likely around Colwich and the third being the day of the Discs Unlimited Open.
Getting KDGA stamped discs for fundraising was another idea. Getting a donation page on the website and on the sign-up form was also mentioned.
Increasing the KDGA membership dues was supported. A $5 increase to $30 was favored. I assume this goes into effect for 2007?
I also remember hearing that the KDGA needs an officer to serve as secretary.
We discussed this season in light of last years goals as mentioned above.
The PDGA sanctioning paid by the KDGA was a great success. We had more PDGA events than ever before and they brought many more players than average KDGA events.
The Ace fund was a great addition to the tour.
The course improvement fun paid out (at the meeting) to the only club that applied for it all year. Emporia Disc Golf Club was matched with money to pay for KDGA stamped concrete tee pads at Peter Pan. I believe it was a $500 check.
The finals location was discussed. Ideas for 2008 and beyond included the region with the most members, the region with the largest increase in members, and a regular set rotation.
One thing that was not a complete success was following through with the rule we made requiring tournament directors to be KDGA members. The consensus seemed to be that there would be no exceptions next year.
We also had some trouble aquiring the $50 minimum per tournament. There was a little disagreement about this issue. Some see that 38 tour events is too many. 11 of these events had less than 10 member show up. So some think that it's not worth losing players from other tournaments for these tournaments that do not benifit the KDGA. Others thought that these small tourneys need the KDGA for promotion and should be cut some slack. Mace brought up the idea of having these small events on the tour every 2 years instead of every year.
There were also some new ideas brought up.
We plan to make the KDGA a PDGA affiliated group. This will mean a $5 discount for anyone who pays PDGA dues through the KDGA. Also a free officials test for anyone who signs up. The KDGA also gets a course directory and a section on the PDGA forum. The first of 3 deadlines to get these dues in will by on 01-01-07. The second being most likely around Colwich and the third being the day of the Discs Unlimited Open.
Getting KDGA stamped discs for fundraising was another idea. Getting a donation page on the website and on the sign-up form was also mentioned.
Increasing the KDGA membership dues was supported. A $5 increase to $30 was favored. I assume this goes into effect for 2007?
I also remember hearing that the KDGA needs an officer to serve as secretary.
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Schoen-hopper
- Posts: 6301
- Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2004 12:58 pm
Here, I'll post a few of my own thoughts about next year. I'd like to hear some other takes, including anything new that hasn't yet been discussed. I'm sure we can keep a positive outlook and work together to make next year even better.
First, we need more members! How do we get people to sign up? What decides whether golfer X wants to sign up? We need ideas. Getting people informed as to what the KDGA does is the first thing (ace fund, oz tour, points, etc). Keeping the membership "package" generous is probably another. Great shirts are always a plus. Other items such as stickers or minis are cool too.
Fundraising? The KDGA can do bigger and better things for Kansas disc golf if they have a budget to work with. I love the idea of getting some KDGA stamped discs made. If these looked cool, who wouldn't buy at least one?
Next is the points race. I think it can be tweaked in a relatively small way that would be of benefit in several ways. The idea is to give each region 3 events that would serve as "supertour" events. These 15 events would earn double points for all members who attend. This would give attention to each region and make scheduling for next year a little more organized. This would also bring more members to the bigger events. I don't have a problem with 38 events on tour if there is more benefit given to those who attend bigger and better tournaments. Lastly, even though there will be more total points, I believe that this would tighten up the points race a bit. There will be more places switching spots, especially after big events, and this will be more fun.
On the qualification, I would like to see every division considered (not just top pro and am) for the last tournament qualifiers. Maybe a couple spots could also be given away in the second to last or a big mid-year tournament?
On the regional qualifications, I'd like to see it changed back to top pro and am only (if not already qualified) for each region. More tourney qualifiers and less regional qualifiers will be more fair to those who participate in the tour.
As to the location of the final event, I don't know the best answer. I like having it centrally located. Salina, Emporia, and Wichita have been past choices probably for this reason. I don't have a problem with a rotation. I would like to see a PDGA event the day before the final though. I thought that this worked great this year.
As for the final, I can see there are some differing thoughts. To refocus and take away some of the pressure to have things perfect for everybody... what if we took up to half of the money used for the finals and came up with something permanent for the benefit of everyone? I liked hearing the idea of getting a new KDGA disc golf course installed. It would be hard to raise enough money to make the course as good as it would need to be, though. What if we did like the course improvement fund and made it a matching course installation fund? The quality and location of the course as well as other factors could be up to the KDGA board to vote on. I'm sure we can come up with some additional ideas on this subject.
On the actual format of the final, my opinion is that there could be some improvement. The main reason was similar to that which was already expressed: we want everyone to feel like they have a chance to win something at the end of the year. This is what I feel that a lot of players have looked forward to over the years. The byes and the uncertainty of how the pairings would end up were a couple things I didn't favor with the match play format. The biggest thing I didn't like was how it favored the top players in each division. It's not that I don't think these player deserve to win, it's just that we already have 2 and 4 round tournaments that decide this fairly uniformly time and time again. I think we have to give everyone more of a shot.
What is the format that pays out for each hole rather than for 36 or 72 holes? I think we finished the tour with a skins match for many years for a reason. Playing heads up with all the best players of the season on an incredible skins course is pretty hard to beat. Here are some simple ideas for improvements to this format that would seem to make it a great experience for everyone.
First, the match would be for each division (not just pro and am). This year, most divisions had between 3 and 8 players that qualified. Huge 10 and 12 man groups that take forever would no longer be a problem.
With the extra time, you could play 18 holes rather than just 10, as in previous times. You would still have plenty of time to schedule other activities or events.
I've heard that skins is "all luck". While even the luck element is fun, there are some changes that could be made to make it more fair. First, give one third of the payout to the top third "total score finishers" in each division. This would make it like a tournament and skins at the same time. Second, if one third of the players or less tie for the best score for a hole, the hole pays out. Most all players would win something in this way, and there would not be one player winning all the skins on the last hole. The better players would still have an advantage, but not as much of one.
I know this isn't that important to everyone. I just think that for the points race to have a signifance to all members (acheiving greater oz tour attendance), their purpose should be clear and the final should be something everyone looks forward to.
First, we need more members! How do we get people to sign up? What decides whether golfer X wants to sign up? We need ideas. Getting people informed as to what the KDGA does is the first thing (ace fund, oz tour, points, etc). Keeping the membership "package" generous is probably another. Great shirts are always a plus. Other items such as stickers or minis are cool too.
Fundraising? The KDGA can do bigger and better things for Kansas disc golf if they have a budget to work with. I love the idea of getting some KDGA stamped discs made. If these looked cool, who wouldn't buy at least one?
Next is the points race. I think it can be tweaked in a relatively small way that would be of benefit in several ways. The idea is to give each region 3 events that would serve as "supertour" events. These 15 events would earn double points for all members who attend. This would give attention to each region and make scheduling for next year a little more organized. This would also bring more members to the bigger events. I don't have a problem with 38 events on tour if there is more benefit given to those who attend bigger and better tournaments. Lastly, even though there will be more total points, I believe that this would tighten up the points race a bit. There will be more places switching spots, especially after big events, and this will be more fun.
On the qualification, I would like to see every division considered (not just top pro and am) for the last tournament qualifiers. Maybe a couple spots could also be given away in the second to last or a big mid-year tournament?
On the regional qualifications, I'd like to see it changed back to top pro and am only (if not already qualified) for each region. More tourney qualifiers and less regional qualifiers will be more fair to those who participate in the tour.
As to the location of the final event, I don't know the best answer. I like having it centrally located. Salina, Emporia, and Wichita have been past choices probably for this reason. I don't have a problem with a rotation. I would like to see a PDGA event the day before the final though. I thought that this worked great this year.
As for the final, I can see there are some differing thoughts. To refocus and take away some of the pressure to have things perfect for everybody... what if we took up to half of the money used for the finals and came up with something permanent for the benefit of everyone? I liked hearing the idea of getting a new KDGA disc golf course installed. It would be hard to raise enough money to make the course as good as it would need to be, though. What if we did like the course improvement fund and made it a matching course installation fund? The quality and location of the course as well as other factors could be up to the KDGA board to vote on. I'm sure we can come up with some additional ideas on this subject.
On the actual format of the final, my opinion is that there could be some improvement. The main reason was similar to that which was already expressed: we want everyone to feel like they have a chance to win something at the end of the year. This is what I feel that a lot of players have looked forward to over the years. The byes and the uncertainty of how the pairings would end up were a couple things I didn't favor with the match play format. The biggest thing I didn't like was how it favored the top players in each division. It's not that I don't think these player deserve to win, it's just that we already have 2 and 4 round tournaments that decide this fairly uniformly time and time again. I think we have to give everyone more of a shot.
What is the format that pays out for each hole rather than for 36 or 72 holes? I think we finished the tour with a skins match for many years for a reason. Playing heads up with all the best players of the season on an incredible skins course is pretty hard to beat. Here are some simple ideas for improvements to this format that would seem to make it a great experience for everyone.
First, the match would be for each division (not just pro and am). This year, most divisions had between 3 and 8 players that qualified. Huge 10 and 12 man groups that take forever would no longer be a problem.
With the extra time, you could play 18 holes rather than just 10, as in previous times. You would still have plenty of time to schedule other activities or events.
I've heard that skins is "all luck". While even the luck element is fun, there are some changes that could be made to make it more fair. First, give one third of the payout to the top third "total score finishers" in each division. This would make it like a tournament and skins at the same time. Second, if one third of the players or less tie for the best score for a hole, the hole pays out. Most all players would win something in this way, and there would not be one player winning all the skins on the last hole. The better players would still have an advantage, but not as much of one.
I know this isn't that important to everyone. I just think that for the points race to have a signifance to all members (acheiving greater oz tour attendance), their purpose should be clear and the final should be something everyone looks forward to.
The KDGA needs a mission statement. This gives the organization focus, even when things get slow. (Notice how we mainly have this discussion twice, Mid year and year end.)
Just a thought.
Just a thought.
I fear not the man who has practiced 10,000 kicks once, but I fear the man who has practiced one kick 10,000 times.
This was one of the items talked about also. This year both divisions had $750 for each division and next year it will only be $500 for each with this money going to a course inprovement. One thing for people to remimber is that a few years ago only the top 12 player had a chance at the end of year money.Schoen-hopper wrote:
As for the final, I can see there are some differing thoughts. To refocus and take away some of the pressure to have things perfect for everybody... what if we took up to half of the money used for the finals and came up with something permanent for the benefit of everyone? I liked hearing the idea of getting a new KDGA disc golf course installed. It would be hard to raise enough money to make the course as good as it would need to be, though. What if we did like the course improvement fund and made it a matching course installation fund? The quality and location of the course as well as other factors could be up to the KDGA board to vote on. I'm sure we can come up with some additional ideas on this subject.
For whatever it's worth, there will be some people from Parsons joining the KDGA this year. I know of at least one...myself. I'm sure we'll actually have 2 or 3 sign up. As for the KDGA fee for having an Oz Tour stop, it doesn't really seem fair if you've scheduled an event for someone on the same day as another huge event in the area. I know we didn't have any KDGA members this year and you guys let us have an Oz spot out of the kindness of your hearts, so I'm seriously not bitchin' about it, but I know of a few guys who went to the Oklahoma Open (scheduled for the same weekend) instead of to our tourney. How would that work out for future reference?
You guys really appear to do a great job and I'm lookin' forward to becoming a member next year and tryin' to make it out to some tourney's. Along those lines...when do you fellas usually pay dues? At the begining of the year?
You guys really appear to do a great job and I'm lookin' forward to becoming a member next year and tryin' to make it out to some tourney's. Along those lines...when do you fellas usually pay dues? At the begining of the year?
holsinger wrote: a few guys who went to the Oklahoma Open (scheduled for the same weekend) instead of to our tourney. How would that work out for future reference?
Your event was on the schedule in Jan. of last year. The PDGA tells Oklahoma when they can run their Super Tour event.
I was actually planning on coming to Parsons for the first time. I couldn't pass up the chance to play against many of the top players in our region, and farther.
I hope that several Parsonites sign-up for the KDGA.
Mike-
I think that we are going to stick with the same finals format for atleast a couple of years.
I do know that no nearly as much money will be dumped into the finals from now on.
I also think that qualifing more people would be great. I called any player that was qualified, and wasn't a normal forum user. This got ateast 3 people to show.
We had all but 2-4 people show. That is better then in the past years, when we had several no shows.
We have a couple of months to get all the details worked out. So lets keep the ideas rolling.
I think that we are going to stick with the same finals format for atleast a couple of years.
I do know that no nearly as much money will be dumped into the finals from now on.
I also think that qualifing more people would be great. I called any player that was qualified, and wasn't a normal forum user. This got ateast 3 people to show.
We had all but 2-4 people show. That is better then in the past years, when we had several no shows.
We have a couple of months to get all the details worked out. So lets keep the ideas rolling.
I really planned on being there myself. I was going to play the tourney on Saturday and stick around for the club banquet and finals on Sunday but I got hurt the week before and couldn't play at all. I was bummed. Sorry I couldn't make it. I separated some ribs on a Boy Scout outing and am still not able to play.
I was looking forward to doing the match play thing. Hopefully it will work out better for me next year.
I was looking forward to doing the match play thing. Hopefully it will work out better for me next year.
Eschew Obfuscation
